This is part two of two in this HTML version. This second part comprises questions and answers #13 through the end. The headers, list of questions and #1 through #12 are in the first page.

Although many people have given estimates, it's impossible to know this due to the number of people "in the broom closet." However, all branches of the neopagan movement are steadily growing.

14) Why isn't it soc.religion.paganism instead of alt.pagan?

Because we had a vote to create a talk.religion.paganism newsgroup back in January 1990 and it was voted down, largely because the proposed group was to be moderated and people didn't like that idea. So, when that failed, some enterprising soul took it upon himself to create alt.pagan, because you don't need approval to do that.

Since then, we have discussed changing newsgroup hierarchies (usually to either soc.religion or talk.religion), but the consensus at present seems to be to keep the format we have. Being typical pagans, we like as little structure as possible.

15) Is brutal honesty or polite conversation the preferred mode of conversation around here?

People tend to get a little rowdy around here sometimes, so don't let it get to you. One of the disadvantages to this type of communication is the increased possibility of misunderstanding due to the inability to see the person and hear his or her vocal inflections, see their facial expressions, et cetera. It's generally frowned upon to attack someone baselessly, but there is no problem with disagreeing with someone vigorously -- vociferously, even. Try being constructive.

16) What are some of the related newsgroups?

(This list subject to change at any time)
alt.religion.wicca
alt.religion.druid
alt.mythology
alt.satanism
alt.magick
alt.astrology
alt.divination
alt.discordia
talk.religion.newage

17) I'm not a pagan; should I post here?

Yes, definitely -- with a couple of caveats:

a) Don't come on to witness to us. We're really not interested in being converted (or worse, saved). It's not a tenet of our path to convert, and so we are particularly unhappy with the idea. Plus which, you will add unnecessarily to the noise level in this newsgroup, since most readers will feel compelled to flame you to the farthest reaches of Hell.

(This doesn't mean we don't want to discuss aspects of other religions as they relate to paganism, however. Discussion we like. Argument, even. But *not* witness attempts.)

b) If you're new to News, then you might want to check out news.announce.newusers for the posting protocol. And you might want to read some articles for a while -- get the feel of things -- before you post.

And remember, Usenet and Internet provide you with (among other things) the opportunity to make a total fool of yourself in front of thousands of people worldwide, *and* include the bonus of having it preserved on CD-ROM for many years afterwards.

18) How does one/do I become a pagan?

Most followers of pagan beliefs feel that, if someone is meant to find the pagan path, s/he will eventually. Usually, it is not a case so much of "becoming" a pagan as it is of finding a vocabulary for ideas and beliefs that you have always held. Good ways of investigating if this path is for you is to frequent pagan or new age bookstores, attend open pagan gatherings when the opportunity arises, and look for contacts. Most importantly, read read read! There are plenty of good books out there, as well as periodicals. The latter especially might be useful in the way of making contacts in your area.

19) What books/magazines should I read?

There are many, many good books on this subject (and quite a few bad ones), and different bibliographies are available on the Internet. But the best book to read is _Drawing Down the Moon_ by Margot Adler. This is not a how-to book; it's a comprehensive study of the neopagan movement in America, and the author is a journalist, a reporter for National Public Radio, and a pagan.

Also, to get started contacting other pagans, the best place to write is Circle Network, P.O. Box 219, Mt. Horeb, WI, 53572. Circle is the largest pagan network in the country and publishes a guide to pagan groups around the United States, Canada, and overseas. They might be able to get you in touch with pagans in your area if you can't find them yourself. They also have an extensive list of available publications.

For residents of the UK who are looking for contacts, try getting in touch with the Pagan Federation. Similar to Circle in intent, they publish a quarterly newsletter and provides contact information for UK pagans. Their address is Pagan Federation, BM Box 7097, London, WC1N 3XX, United Kingdom.

If you start with that, then you will generally find pointers to other sources and resources.

20) How do I find pagans/Witches/covens/teachers in my area? How do I evaluate them?

Some of your best contacts may come from your local new age, pagan or occult bookstores. Check their bulletin boards for notices, or ask the staff. Also, many periodicals frequently allow people to advertise for contacts in their particular area. Circle Network, based in Wisconsin, has recently come out with an updated guide to pagan groups; it is available by mail-order or through certain new age bookstores.

Don't be in a hurry to find a teacher. "When the student is ready, the teacher will appear" is a popular saying in most pagan and Craft communities. Frustrating as that may sound, it's really a sensible way to think. Neopaganism, like any esoteric movement, attracts its share of unsavory characters. When you do meet people, use your intuition. If they seem somehow "off" to you, then they're probably not for you. If no one seems like someone you think you'd like to be with, then you're probably better off working solitary, at least for such time as you find no compatible people.

And by no means should you infer from this that all solitaries are "pagans-in-waiting". Many people are quite happy to work alone, and in fact prefer it. There is nothing wrong with working on your own as long as you like -- even if that turns out to be a lifetime. In fact, there are several people who highly recommend that you study on your own for a while before looking for others to work with. This gives you the chance to get started figuring out what feels right for you without having pressure from others to conform to their beliefs and dogmas.

21) What's a coven really like?

Well, if you're expecting to hear about sex and blood magic, animal sacrifice, and ritual cruelty, then you'll be disappointed. Forming or joining a coven is a spiritual commitment (the words coven and covenant are related) that is entered into advisedly. Once that bond is made, though, you find yourself in a spiritual community of people who have roughly the same theology, getting together to celebrate the passing of the seasons and the cycles of the moon, providing support and comfort to its members -- a lot like a small spiritual community of any faith. Another common saying in the Craft is "In perfect love and perfect trust," and that sums up the relationship among coveners pretty well.

Another kind of group for like-minded pagans to gather in is called a circle. The ties between coven members are as close as those between members of a family, and in some cases, closer. A circle is similar to a group of friends -- you like to do things together, but the bonds between members are not as serious as between coven-members.

22) How do I form a coven?

Just as you shouldn't be in a big rush to find a teacher, you probably shouldn't set right out to form a coven. Most Witches believe the coven bond to be a very intense and serious one, one that applies on the Karmic as well as mundane levels. Think of it as getting married -- you wouldn't marry the first people you met who are interested in getting married too, would you?

Forming a circle, or a magical study group, is perhaps a better first step. It can be on a relatively informal basis, and you and the other participants can get to know each other while learning about the Craft together (as a matter of fact, many covens are formed from study groups). The fun of this is that you can meet more people who are interested in what you're interested in, and you can all learn together, and maybe even develop a tradition from the results of your studies. (You can do this as a solitary, of course, but some people do take more enjoyment in working with others. Once again, do what's right for you.)

The steps for contacting people to form a coven are much the same as finding other pagans and Witches in your area. A word of advice, though: You may want to leave your last name off, or get a P.O. box. Don't give out your number (unless you have an answering machine). Advertising yourself as being interested in this sort of thing might attract, shall we say, undesirables. Try writing such a notice so that those who are probably interested in similar ideals will know what you're talking about without attracting the attention of people who aren't. Even though *we* know that we're perfectly ethical and legitimate, not everyone else does.

23) What does Dianic mean?

Like everything else in neopaganism and the Craft, the term Dianic is one that has several meanings. A majority of those who call themselves Dianic are women that choose not to work with male energy in their ritual, magic, or universe. They feel that they need spiritual and psychic space filled with only women's energy.

Some Dianics are feminist Witches, both lesbian and heterosexual, who often come to the Craft through feminism. Although these women may be involved with men in one way or another, they agree that religion has over-emphasized the male for the last several thousand years, and therefore want to share their women's energy in women's circles. They may or may not also be involved with the mainstream pagan community, and they may or may not participate in magic and ritual with men.

The most visible groups of Dianics are those who are lesbian Dianics. They are generally not interested in revering any sort of male deity or in working with men in circle. They choose to limit their dependence on and acceptance of the male-defined world as much as possible, and they do so not to exclude men but rather to celebrate women and the feminine. For that reason many of them do not interact much with the "mainstream" pagan community.

(There are also those who call themselves Dianic and who are not like those described above, but who practice Witchcraft based on the traditions found books like those of anthropologist Margaret Murray. However, the term is more often meant to designate those practitioners described in the first two paragraphs. This definition is taken largely from the book _To Know_ by Jade.)

24) Aren't women-only circles discriminatory?

Yes, women-only circles are discriminatory. So what? *ALL* circles are somewhat discriminatory, even if the only discrimination is that they'll evict preachers who disrupt the proceedings of the circle.

If you're worried about being discriminatory in your own circle, simply look at the circle as a group of friends. Then, the discrimination is simply a limit on who you'll have as your friends, which is undeniably a good thing.

If you're worried about being discriminated against, then you can form your own circle, and you have the option to make it a men-only circle. Why do you want to intrude into a social space where you're not wanted?

If the participants are discussing business-related things affecting you during their circle, then you have legal rights to be allowed to participate, regardless of whether the discrimination is gender-related or not. It would be good advice to avoid such topics during circle. If you're worried that a circle from which you're excluded is doing so, you can talk to a lawyer to find out what those rights are and whether it will be wise and useful to pursue them.

Ultimately, though, you need to remember that some people feel strongly that some mysteries are gender-related and therefore it is not appropriate to have men (or women, depending) in attendance. It's not a plot to keep you out or to make you feel bad, but rather quite an ancient method of exploring certain mysteries that only apply to one sex (e.g. menstruation).

25) Can/will you cast me a love spell/curse my enemies?

Can we? Probably. (Whether it might yield the desired result is something else.) Will we? Not on your life, bucko.

Pagans and Witches usually believe in some form of what's called the Witches' Rede: "As long as you harm no one, do what you will." That isn't nearly as easy as it might sound. That means whatever action you undertake, it can't harm anyone, including yourself. Witches and pagans also believe in some form of the Law of Return: "Whatever you do magically [or otherwise] will come back to you," some say three times, some nine, some just say it will come back to you. And it does. As Ursula K. LeGuin said, "You can't light a candle without somewhere casting a shadow."

Most of us believe that it is wrong to use magical power to coerce someone into doing something against his or her free will. Curses and love spells are the most prevalent examples of manipulative magic. Some Witches and pagans do believe that using one's powers in defense (say, to assure a rapist's getting caught) is all right; others do not. Those who do choose to work that kind of magic do so knowing that it will come back to them, and are making an informed choice when they decide to do so.

This makes it sound as if we spend our lives deciding whether to curse or hex someone, when that's not true. Most of the time, our spells and magical workings are for such things as healing the planet, getting a job (or otherwise bringing prosperity into our lives), healing (both ourselves and others), and spiritual empowerment. Spells are really quite similar to prayer -- they just have more Hollywood hoopla attached to them.

Besides, anything you do for yourself will work much better than a spell or working done by someone else.

26) Is it okay if I...? Will I still be a pagan if I...?

Yes. Most pagans take a clearly anti-authorative (no one is your superior) stance when it comes to other pagans' religious practices. Ideally, we try to remember the relativity of our values.

One of the major advantages of neopaganism, is that it is defined by you, and that is what makes it so empowering (making you feel your own power). Nobody can tell you that you aren't a true neopagan, because *you* decide what's right for *you*. There are no dogmas (truth defined by an expert) in neopaganism, simply because there couldn't possibly be any expert who knows better than you what feels right for you. Many pagans also appreciate the Discordian catma (related to dog-ma): "Any Discordian is expressly forbidden to believe what she reads." We also like the paradox in this cuddly catma.

You are encouraged to share your new ideas and inventions with us, but a statement along with a request for comments will probably give you more informative replies than asking your fellow netters for permission to do what is right for you. A "Am I still okay if I..." question will probably leave you with dozens of responses containing the most frequently given piece of advice on alt.pagan: Do what feels right for you. If what you really want is to hear that you are okay, please turn to alt.support.

27) I am a pagan and I think I am being discriminated against because of my religion. What should I do?

First of all, don't panic. Are you really being discriminated against, or are things happening to you that would happen no matter what your religious beliefs were? Not to belittle religious discrimination because of course it happens, but you want to be sure that's what is going on before you take measures based on that assumption.

If, after looking at the situation objectively, you feel that you are being treated the way you are *specifically because of your religion*, then there are groups you can contact who specialize in giving assistance in just this very thing. One is Circle Network, whose address is given above. Another is AMER (Alliance of Magical and Earth Religions), and they can be reached through Chris Carlisle at C24884@wuvmd.wustl.edu, or from addresses on several hobbyist networks including FIDONET as well.

28) Hey, I heard that [insert name of famous rock singer or fantasy-novel writer here] was a witch/pagan. Is that true?

Well, the quick and dirty answer is: we don't know; why not ask them?

Seriously, this question is asked most frequently about those artists/writers who use occult or magical imagery in their work (Stevie Nicks and Mercedes Lackey being the most commonly-asked-about people). Just because someone uses that imagery in their work -- even if it's in a positive, pro-paganism way -- does not mean that they are pagan themselves. The vast wealth of material provided by myth, folklore and occult knowledge is a tempting and lucrative well of inspiration for creative artists. But its use does not automatically link the user to the Craft or paganism. And that's okay. They don't have to be pagans to write about pagans, or about pagan ideas. They are creating art. That is their job. If the art reflects your life, well and good. Just don't expect it to also be a mirror image of the artist.

In short, unless the person in question has unequivocally stated that s/he is a pagan (e.g., Patricia Kennealy-Morrison, a Celtic high priestess and author of the _Keltiad_ series), you can't assume that s/he is a pagan. (Even then, they could change their minds, like Gael Baudino did, or give different answers at different times, like Marion Zimmer Bradley keeps doing.) Does it really make that book or song or painting less meaningful to you if you don't know the religion of its creator?

29) What one thing would most pagans probably want the world to know about them?

The answer included here comes from Margot Adler's excellent book _Drawing Down the Moon: Witches, Druids, Goddess-Worshippers and Other Pagans in America Today_ (the revised edition). If after reading this FAQ, you want to learn even more about modern paganism, we highly recommend this book. It is available in most bookstores and in many libraries.

"We are not evil. We don't harm or seduce people. We are not dangerous. We are ordinary people like you. We have families, jobs, hopes, and dreams. We are not a cult. This religion is not a joke. We are not what you think we are from looking at T.V. We are real. We laugh, we cry. We are serious. We have a sense of humor. You don't have to be afraid of us. We don't want to convert you. And please don't try to convert us. Just give us the same right we give you -- to live in peace. We are much more similar to you than you think."

-- Margot Adler, _Drawing Down the Moon_, p.453.

AFTERWORD

The creators of this FAQ want to thank the readers of alt.pagan for their input in compiling the questions. We will be more than happy to revise it to include the points of view from other readers. If you would like to add information to this FAQ, please send email to susanhk@mail.utexas.edu with your proposed addition.

Thank you and Blessed Be!

**References**

_Drawing Down the Moon_, Margot Adler, Beacon Press.
_To Know_, Jade, Delphi Press.

--
Beannachta!
---Susan Harwood Kaczmarczik-------------------
---susanhk@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu---
"The hart he loves the high wood, the hare she loves the hill;
The Knight he loves his bright sword, the Lady -- loves her will."